Sophie: Hi guys, my name is Sophie Ireton, and I have a special guest with me today. I’m actually sitting here with my fiancée Sarah Wood. Hi Sarah!

Sarah: Hi!

Sophie: So the reason I brought Sarah on here today is that she and I recently moved to a new apartment and we’ve been witnessing something going on since then that I thought might be pertinent to discuss. So Sarah can you tell me a little bit about what happened?

Sarah: Yeah, um, so like Sophie said we moved to a new apartment in -around the end of January so we’ve been here for a couple months and when we moved we noticed that the people to the left of us and to the right of us they’re both pretty loud. I think the walls might be kind of thin but we can just hear them throughout the day. They’re just pretty noisy. And then we’ve been noticing that a couple times now that the police have been called on the people to the right of us and there have been some noise complaints against them.

Sophie: What we found was interesting, what we thought might make this worth discussing is that that family on the right, um, they are black and the family on the left is white. It starts to make you think you know about what may be causing that. So, you know, in your opinion, Sarah what do you, why do you think we’re seeing this this disparity in the police response to these, these two noisy apartments?

Sarah: I think the reason we’re seeing the difference between the response of the people on the right of us and the left, like Sophie said the people on the right are black. I think it has a lot to do with the town that we live in, in it’s kind of a small town. Um, there’s not a lot of diversity in the town we live in. It’s primarily white and from what we’ve noticed the couple times the police have come is that the police officers are white. So, I think it just has to do with it, um, how like not diverse the town is I would say, and I think it is some racism, whether it’s intended or not against that family.

Sophie: Yeah, and I’ve -we’ve actually had some issues with the unit behind us as well and this is when I first started really thinking about how this could be more than just, you know, upset neighbors, potentially racist neighbors, you know it could be something to do with the police force itself is because you know these people behind us we’ve had some issues with them. Um, I think most of the problems that they have it’s not so much noise it’s more like drug related issues and some actual illegal stuff. It’s important to emphasize, you know this family that keeps having the cops called on them on the right of us they’re not doing anything like illegal or dangerous they just seem to be loud, whereas this family, um, behind us, we’ve never really seen them or seen what’s going on with them but we actually were told by our land manager that that the cops were aware of them.

Sophie: So, because this is a small area, um the fact that they can have so many issues with people behind us they actually seem to know these people tells me, you know, well they’re showing up to this family to the right of us, you know, multiple times. It’s been several times since we moved in that we’ve seen them show up there. They may actually have, you know that visual representation when they’re thinking about noise complaints, are thinking about particular units. It may be, you know, the bias might begin before they even show up at the front door because they might actually know who these people are. It’s hard not to see this situation and not think that there might be something more going on there.

Sophie: You know, Sarah and I, we grew up in a predominantly white area, and an area that we didn’t really have to witness this very often you know you grow up and you, you try to keep yourself aware and informed and you try to believe what you’re hearing but we did grow up with a lot of privilege in that we didn’t have to experience that ourselves but we also didn’t have to witness it, you know, being experienced. I think it’s, you know, now being in the position that I am where I can notice these situations and try to think okay well what could be going on there, I think says everything about what we need to do, you know, as American citizens you know we need to keep ourselves not just informed on what’s going on but try to stay aware of it, try to see when this stuff happens, you know? Sarah what why do you think these situations occur? What do you think is going on in general that situations like this happens so frequently?

Sarah: I think in this situation and others like it I think a lot of it has to do with bias, and the labels that are put on people. So, you know, different minorities have different labels and though some are considered better than others I would say that they’re still putting people in a box. So, with black people, and from the BLM movement, um, especially gaining traction in the last year, I’ve noticed that the label put on black people I, I’ve noticed two but the first one is that they’re dangerous or aggressive and then the second is up they’re loud. So, like Sophie said I’m not sure if the police officers now because they’ve responded to that house a couple times to the right of us with the noise complaint, if they know or if there’s a file or something like that and they know the people they’re going to go check on is a black family or not, but I think a lot of it just has to do with those labels and people are put in those boxes. So, I think that really affects how often the police are called on them and the response once the police are here.

Sophie: Right. I think it also, you know, we rent at this apartment complex. You know they -It may just be an angry neighbor, you know, like we’ve clarified it may just be you know a racist angry neighbor and they might just be lashing out. I know in America, we, we grow up with this kind of, you know, blind patriotism that we’re taught you know America is perfect. There’s nothing wrong with us. It’s not until you get older and you start to really pay attention to the world around you that you start to realize the kind of issues that we have here systematically, and someone who’s, you know, as white people we hold a lot of privilege and we grew up with a lot of privilege, and it can be, you know, much easier to lash out at -at others or blame others or, you know, deny than it is to have these hard conversations you know listen to these, you know, black and minority voices and believe them.

Sophie: But what makes this so dangerous is that, you know, we may ignore something because we don’t want to believe it and then we may, you know, live without awareness, um, as I’m thinking this neighbor does as I think maybe this police force does. You may not even realize that you’re holding biases but then suddenly you’ve called the cops on, you know, a noisy neighbor a few times and maybe it didn’t it didn’t really need to happen. And suddenly a family, maybe loses their home or their job or you know what we’ve, we’ve been made very aware of recently is that there can be very dangerous anytime that there is police interaction, especially in a predominantly white area like we’re in, especially in an area that’s, you know, known to be not very kind to minorities like we’re in, it can be incredibly dangerous every time, you know, black families, particularly black men have to deal with the cops. Um, so like what, what do you think that we can do you know as white women as you know citizens in America, what do you think that we can do to try and help and try to, you know, better this country?

Sarah: I think like you said, we just need to be better about keeping ourselves educated on the issues that other groups face other minorities, other genders face. Just keep yourself educated on that, but I think also, we just need to let the little things go like in the case of our neighbors. Like Sophie was saying it doesn’t seem like they’re doing anything illegal. They’re not being disrespectfully loud. I have before heard the people behind us walking up the stairs because they’re creaky. So, I think we just need to like give people a little break and think about what is the worst case that could come out of this. So, like she was saying the worst case could be that these people have to move, um, move homes and that could affect you know their income, it could affect their happiness all these sorts of things. So, I think at the end of the day we just need to kind of step back and think about what could happen-

Sophie: Right.

Sarah: if you do this.

Sophie: Yeah, I think, I think you brought up a really good point towards the end there, sorry I kind of jumped in, because it’s, it’s important to know, you know, letting those little things go in, in that if you – Even if you’re unaware of yourself holding bias, you can make yourself aware of, okay, I am calling the cops on a noisy neighbor and it makes -it’d be easy to feel very justified in doing that, you know, they keep me up all the time it can be easy to get angry and easy to lash out in those ways but calling the cops on a noisy white neighbor is not the same thing as calling the cops on a noisy black neighbor and unfortunately in America that’s just how things are, you know? Likely the worst case scenario we call the cops on a noisy white neighbor, they get maybe a slap on the wrist you know it takes a lot of interaction for things really serious to occur there. If we call the cops on an angry black neighbor, you know, if you know a black man opens the door, you know, it could end up being a very dangerous situation and is that noise complaint, really worth it? Especially to the degree that we’ve been noticing that them calling the cops on this family, you know having awareness is concerned to, to prevent situations like that from happening at least as frequently as they do. You know, a few months ago I watched a TED talk by a Nigerian writer. Her name is Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie and she, she talks about the concept of a single story, which is, you know, her example was as Americans, we have a single story of Africa we think of poverty, we think of struggle and it makes it really easy for us to hold on to biases and deny you know maybe biases that we have for, you know, Africans because we hold this single story and we have stories like this, about, you know, many more minorities many other countries we have a single story about ourselves that we’re very patriot-, like, we’re very patriotic we’re very perfect we’re not, you know, we’re the land of the free and I think a very important thing that we can do as Americans as we grow up, is to try to become aware of the systematic racism of the systematic injustices that we have in our country, and know that growing up in the system these stories that we that we hear they’re not always correct and they’re definitely not the only one. You know being aware of this and trying to learn more about others, learn more stories, keep yourselves aware, you know let black and minority voices be heard and then believe them.

Sophie: So all right, it seems like that’s all the time we have today. I just want to reiterate, to our audience that you know Sarah and I were not personally impacted by racism in a negative way. We are both white, so we can’t really begin to fully understand and comprehend, you know, everything that’s happening how it feels and the lessons we need to be taking from this. So, I want to emphasize the importance of doing your own research, research doing your own learning. You know, if there is anything we said or discussed that you feel is incorrect or missed the mark or you just have something to add please feel free to comment. Let us know and keep the conversation going. Um, we really look forward to seeing you all next time!

Sarah: Bye guys!

Transcript:

Yuehua Rong: So, welcome to our podcast and first we’re gonna introduce herself.And hi everyone my name is Yuehua Ring and majoring finance.

Mingxuan Yang: Hi guys, my name is Mingxuan Yang. I’m majoring in psychology, sophomore student in Ohio State University.

Lingyun Zheng: Hi everyone, my name is Lingyun Zheng and I am majored in mathematics.

Yuehua Rong: So we’re gonna talk about racism towards Asian. And before we talk about the cases we’re going to define what is racism.

Lingyun Zheng: In my perspective, I think, racism is a prejudice and discrimination directed against a person or people on the basis of their membership in a particular racial or ethnic group, typically ones that is a minority or marginalized.

Yuehua Rong: So, the reason we talk about this topic is because I believe that all of you have watched the news recently about Asian hate crime. And the murder of the case robber Aaron Alone. He killed eight people at three different Atlanta massage parlors. Some people argue that he’s killing motivation has nothing to do with racism. Well, according to himself. It told the police that he had an addiction to sex that filled his rampage, but denied any racial motivation, long said that he sees the spouse, as temptation and he wanted to eliminate.However, relatives of the victims indicates that they have always been operating illegally massage parlor, and has nothing to do with sex, but the truth is, he killed eight people, and six of them are Asian. Also, even a sex related massage parlor isn’t an excuse for clones someone who clearly has a stereotype for Asians, which he thinks that Asian massage parlor are all related to sex. What do you guys think of this?

Mingxuan Yang: Yes, you’re absolutely right. And although Long keep denying that he went. It is the sexual frustration led him to commit the violence. But when we look up the people, the type of people that he killed it. Because six Asian people are being killed, and also they are some excuses explained by the office Captain Joe Baker, who told the media you know press conference that a sexual addiction may have feel the crime instead Long had had a really bad day.So, having a really bad day. It’s a really. It’s a really funny drug to explaining for queuing like eight people. And also, I must say that, um, since the beginning of the corona virus outbreak. On some Western politicians dress China’s connection to the COVID 19 pandemic. So that Asian people especially the Chinese people become a target for racism. Some people will regarded the coronavirus as Chinese virus and will like play jokes like kung fu something like that.

Lingyun Zheng: I think the reason why so many Asian hate crimes happened in the US is partial credit to former president D T since he posted lots of inappropriate comments on his Twitter account and he pointed out that the COVID -19 has originated from Asia and he used ” China virus” to define COVID-19. what he said spark anti-Asian Twitter content and “likely perpetuated racist attitudes. Many people who support him believe what he said is right and more and more people think that it’s Chinese people who caused COVID-19. Many American people think that the COVID-19 restricts their lives. They are forced to wear masks and they are not allowed to gather together in public so they convert their discontent on Asians.

MingxuanYang: Oh, Yes, I cannot agree with you more. And Donald Trump as the, he used to be the president of the United States and the focus of the media figures, so his words can directly change or affected the opinions of the United States public and the even the behavior. So. Oh, yes, as the pandemic made its way across Europe and also United States North America, Asian people experience the series of verbal assault and also, even the physical harassment. A lot of Asian people indicated that they experienced the unfair treatment in their daily life and some of them even afraid to go outside or use the public transportation. Um, so take myself as an example, last year on April 20. There are about, 50 to 522,000 cases coronal cases in United States, which means it was very dangerous, and we must wear a mask so that we will not like suffer from coronavirus, and, and that a walking through the high street I prefer to buy some food in target and I met a man who stopped me and instead of me that, please not we’re mask. we cannot decide our Death life. Because God only God know that and also he told me, told me that they do know why the coronavirus happens. That is because of you, Chinese people, so his words makes me very uncomfortable. And it is a really.

Mingxuan Yang: Right. It is a very rare case for me, but it happens every day on United States, and Asia Americans suffer from the unfair treatment everyday it becomes very common, even though that like those European people were united states or North America people do not have awareness of that they are stereotyping, a group of minority or a group of people. But even though they are not conscious about that. This phenomenon happens every day, and lots of Asian people encounters, those unfair situation, and we’ll have the risk of being attacked, when they walk on the streets and they do nothing. so similar to this situation, it makes me think about 10 years ago when the aftermath of the September September, July was to southern New while we’re mostly are so when the Muslim. The group of Islam as the terrorist attack to the Americans, a building. So, at that time Muslims experienced the hospital treatment for a long time because American society became begins to consider the group of Islam a terrorist and regard the Muslims as a terrorist, trying to marginalize them and isolate the culture and the people who belongs to this identity.

Lingyun zheng: Yeah, you’re right, not only Asia’s and Muslim are facing discrimination, but also other races. The government’s inaction is also a reason why racism exists. Some policies that discriminate by race and keep people in poverty reinforce racist beliefs. Housing laws are a prime example of this. Many laws kept Black people from owning houses in certain neighborhoods, relegating them to lower-quality housing and preventing them from accumulating wealth. Society looks at this and believes it justifies beliefs about how Black people only live in low-income, crime-ridden neighborhoods.

Mingxuan Yang: Yes. No matter black people or Muslim people were Asian people they as the minority in the whole community they experienced a very unfair treatment and they are still retype  every day. So, according to the investigation, the Asian crime has the, the anti-Asians crime has increased this year to 150%. And a lot of people like makes slander gesture to Asian people and everyday Asian people receive threats. And they will they will encounter some really dirty words like I’ll go back to China, you’re so dirty and they, someone will like you add them in short shout at them to say something really rude words which makes them very comfortable and offend them, to a large extent, so that xenophobia becomes very serious and overt in the United States which becomes a very serious problem that we need to take some actions to, like, to stove it word to on to stop the stereotype.

Lingyun zheng: The reason why so many Asian hate crimes happened recently is due to jealousy of what Asians have achieved. Recently Asians are becoming richer and richer that leads to some Americans believe that it’s Asians steal their resources and wealth which causes their failures. I am going to use an example to illustrate that, if an Asian employee was promoted in a company, his co-workers will try to distance him and slander him behind his back. Asians are facing lots of injustices during this time. 

Mingxuan Yang: Yes, you are right because it is a very obvious things that some Asian people are very talented and have very good ability and good at several fields like computer ,like social media something like that but someone always prevent them from promotion that is because, like, the stereotype, because of their race were because of, like, Where are they from.Um, so, So, returning back to our topic is this raises racism.Um, we have to say that.Although, it comes to be a very rare case, like like some white people attacked to attacked. To some, like Asian people was like very rare but I think it becomes more and more common in our daily life so we need to take a serious and to do some actions to like to do some actions to prevent them be more serious.

Lingyun zheng: It seems like those events appear to be accidental. However, the victims were all Asians so that it’s definitely racism. we need to work together to overcome this tough time. Thank you for listening and hope you have a good time.

Mingxuan Yang: Thank you.

Yuehua Rong: Thank you.

Work Cited:

Eliott C, Casey Tolan, and Amanda Watts (2021), What we know about Robert Aaron Long, the suspect in Atlanta spa shootings.
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/03/17/us/robert-aaron-long-suspected-shooter/index.html

Kimmy Yam(2021), Anti-Asian hate crimes increased by nearly 150% in 2020, mostly in N.Y. and L.A., new report says. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/asian-america/anti-asian-hate-crimes-increased-nearly-150-2020-mostly-n-n1260264

Nicole Hong and Jonah E(2021). BromwichAsian-Americans Are Being Attacked. Why Are Hate Crime Charges So Rare. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/18/nyregion/asian-hate-crimes.html

Sam Cabral (2021).Covid ‘hate crimes’ against Asian Americans on rise. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-56218684

Ohio Students Calesta Holloway and Spencer Marshall discuss the prevalence of systemic racism and its effects on housing across the United States…

 S: Racism is prevalent in many things we fail to recognize each day. In housing it is extremely common. What are some examples of housing  injustices you have seen or experienced?

C: When I think about racism in housing, I first think about how it was against the law for people of color to purchase homes in “suburban” neighborhoods. This lasted until the 60’s when the Fair Housing Act was passed. This lack of being able to purchase homes in better neighborhoods allowed for overcrowding in urbanized areas. This also meant that there were no homes to be passed down to families. Meaning the spread of inequity in home ownership can be explained by the many minorities that did not own land or property at the time due to the many years of slavery they had endured in early generations. Therefore, unlike their white counterparts, there was nothing to give to the following generations to ensure continuation of wealth.  

C: Since Black Americans own homes at a lower rate, what is the result? How might that encourage racism?

S: Since Black Americans many aren’t able to get into homes, their only alternative is to rent. Many times, they make the same amount as the white homeowner. When they rent and don’t build equity, they are left with nothing to show for the money they used on rent. This unfortunately forces them to live in less desirable areas where there are accessible rentals. 

S: Fair Housing legislation was passed to protect the rights of minorities in housing. What are some areas where these laws still don’t allow for equal housing opportunities? 

 C: Although the Fair Housing Act was passed it has never really been enforced. This is evident by the inability or lack of Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) houses in the suburban area. Houses supported by HUD are usually found in urban areas that are already minority filled. This doesn’t mean that Black Americans are being prevented from buying houses in suburban areas. However, Black American may typically have higher debt to income ratios that prevent them from being able to purchase homes in the better suburban areas. This higher debt to income ratio can be attributed to the salaries inequalities. Black Americans tend to have a lower wage in pay versus other races. Therefore, they rely on borrowing money or being forced to succumb to debt by not paying bills.

C: In most statistics about homeownership and race Indigenous Americans are usually left out. Why do you think that is? 

S: There could be a multitude of reasons for this. It could simply be that there is not a large enough population to accurately find these statistics. Or it could be that their statistics are roped in with other minorities. Indigenous Americans are unfortunately among one of the lowest earning classes in America so it would be interesting to see if there are any statistics regarding Indigenous Americans. 

C:Why are suburban areas considered to be better living areas versus urbanized areas?

S: The ideal location of one’s housing should be decided by the homeowner. If someone would like to live in an urban setting, then they should be able to. The opposite is also true. Families should be afforded the apple opportunity to consider living in either setting. Unfortunately, things like Section 8 housing or other government subsidized living areas do not afford the same opportunities. 

C:With wealthier White Americans buying homes in urbanized areas, do you think that this process of gentrification is helping or hurting racial disparities in home ownership and why or why not? 

C: I think the gentrification of neighborhoods is one of the best things for equal housing. When a neighborhood becomes gentrified, those who still own homes in an area reap the benefits of increased property values. This also allows them to see their property value increase even more if they were to decide to make improvements. 

C: In what other ways can urbanized areas become more desirable? What changes would need to occur? 

S: As you said before, gentrification of neighborhoods is an extremely important step towards making urban communities more desirable for all socioeconomic backgrounds. Also, increased government spending in areas of high crime/lower income may make certain areas more desirable.

C: In what ways do you think high crime rates affect homeownership? 

S: For many folks, homeownership is something that is a major investment. So when high crime rates are present in areas where you are making a major investment, people tend to steer clear of these areas. It is for these reasons that landlords buy up the properties for cheap and rent to lower income individuals. 

C: How do you think income disparities play into homeownership?

S: I would say that income disparities certainly do play into homeownership. This goes for all races as those who make less can’t afford as much house as others. However, this brings up the idea of how education in the homebuying process can lead to two different outcomes off of the same level of income. 

S: When it comes to homeownership, Black people own their homes at a significantly lower rate than other races. What do you think could be some reasoning for this?

S: I personally think this is a result of lack of education on what it takes to be approved and how one establishes a credit score before they buy a home. Calesta, what do you think?

C: I think it’s a mixture of lack of education on the approval process and understanding your credit score. I also believe that it is the process of previous years of homeownership and property management. Due to several stacking years of oppression the gap of disparity is at an extreme that unfortunately we have not been able to close the gap after all these years. 

S: What are some ways you recommend that we can bridge the gap in homeownership by race? 

C: In order to bridge the gap in homeownership I think there needs to be earlier education on credit score importance and home buying education. Meaning as early as high school there needs to be some form of education that helps minorities in their future, this includes homebuying. Without proper education and understanding of the importance of real estate the homeownership gap may never be closed. I also think that by providing a program where abandoned houses can be restored for a lower rate or reimbursement would not only help make urban areas more desirable but also help close the homeownership gap.

C: Do you think other minority groups are affected by the homeownership gap attributed by race? What disparities do you think play a role into their inequality if you believe there are any?

S: I believe that the homeownership gap is prevalent with other minorities in addition to Black Americans. I believe the same disparities are present with them that face Black Americans. They face the same lack of education and exposure to the process that in turn puts them at a disadvantage in the home buying process.

C: Would you consider Indigenous homeownership a problem even though the Indigenous groups technically own the land? 

S: This is an excellent point. Indegenous Americans often own the land and most of the business within their area. This could be a result of how there is not as much data regarding their rates of homeownership. Since they may not be recording their transactions with conventional real estate agents or mortgage lenders .

S: Beyond the lack of knowledge on the subject, why do you think that Black Americans have the lowest homeownership rate compared to all races?

C: Besides there being a lack of knowledge, I believe there is a certain level of fear that is associated with home buying. There is fear of breaking out of a comfort zone or what they are used to and there is a fear of denial. Comfort from the constant nature of living and renting.  Then the denial meaning not worthy of owning a home. A sense of rejection for not making enough money or having the means to maintain a home. Black Americans have been told they are not good enough to vote, own property, or even be provided the same education and healthcare. Therefore, I feel there has been so much oppression for the black community that they unfortunately do not have the confidence to want to seek to purchase a home. Therefore, their homeownership rates are much lower compared to any other race.

C: Do you think there are any similarities between the way Black Americans and Indigenous Americans are forced into oppressive lifestyles through homeownership? 

S: I don’t believe that there is any one thing that is causing this. I think that the fact that they are often forced into rental situations automatically puts them at a disadvantage when building their futures. I do think that renting for a lifetime  and not building equity is certainly a factor when it comes to building a future. However, this is not to say renting is not the best option for many. Homeownership can often be a large task and require money that many folks just don’t have. 

This conversation took place between Spencer Marshall and Calesta Holloway.